Return to Main Discussion Page

Discussion

Main Menu | Search Discussions

Search Discussions

 
 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

Abstract - Take Ii

Sell Art Online Art Prints Photography Prints Photography Prints Art Prints

Sell Art Online

in my quest in making abstracts this is my latest efforts. each using different methods. do any of these work for you? while i wasn't going for emotions, do you feel anything?

i used guash and acrylic for these.

thanks


---Mike Savad

Reply Order

Post Reply
 

Robert James Hacunda

2 Years Ago

Interesting that you posted these Mike..I checked out your web site yesterday and looked at your abstracts and said to myself they didn't work.what is doing?.out of all of them the last one has something going on..Mood /downward motion...RJ

 

I think abstracts are a tough knuckle to crack. I've got abstracts in my gallery for over a year now and have only sold 2 fractals recently. It might be how abstract buyers perceive your body of work as a whole and not just the few abstracts you may have. Like you either have all abstracts or you have nothing as far as abstract buyers are concerned. May be worth separating your abstracts into a separate account as an experiment (you can still have them in your standard account as well), just a thought.

"Do you feel anything?" A psychologist will probably respond with the same question to you. If you didn't feel anything, you probably didn't put any feeling behind the abstracts (or any conceptual thought when you were doing them) so buyers probably will get what you put into these, maybe some will like the imagery but not the abstraction from anything of substance. Just my 2 cents.


-W

 

Sharon Norman

2 Years Ago

Hi Mike, the only one that works a little for me is the third one, top row...splash. Personally, I don't care for bright colors on my walls. I like more autumn/dark colors. To me, it seems like your heart isn't in it, so they aren't working. I bought a great digital art software that's somewhat comparable to Corel Painter 12...PostworkShop. Love it, I take a photo and turn it into something completely different. Still practicing so I haven't posted any yet.

 
 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

i don't have much of a heart, or emotion when it comes to paintings, and don't see how it can have those. i'm about methods simulating a response. i don't have that many colors and many are too old to work with. so i just do what i have. if i had to use emotion for something the canvas would be blank.

---Mike Savad

 

Gladys Steele

2 Years Ago

Though I'm not much on abstracts, your method works for me & conveys feelings on 2 of them ...

Just Another Monday - the explosion of color conveys a feeling that someone threw something against a wall, like "I already can't wait until the work week is over!!" ... Impatience.
Lost in the City - the colors & overcast convey a feeling of never finding your way out of a place unknown ... Dread.

Just my 10 cents worth :)

 

Vivian ANDERSON

2 Years Ago

I'm taking all of this very badly, Mike..........you mock the whole process using colours that are hanging around, old, without any intelligent thought process....this annoys me very much. It's like the work of a defiant child with little or no wish to convey art....just someone so immature they're willing to waste my time........with such audacity as to address real artists, as if your work qualifies....well, it doesn't Mike.........get a heart !

Until now, I've avoided discussing Art directly with you, though have been appreciative of your advice about other matters.....but , this has to be the worst self-indulgence, to even suggest your work, without colour knowledge or heart, has any place in the lexicon of abstraction. You're just throwing paint........and a tantrum..........no more from me, even IF you reply

""don't have much of a heart, or emotion when it comes to paintings,""

edit: so just what are you doing?

 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

why do i care about your thoughts vivian? so because i don't understand painting, and because i don't want to invest - that somehow the art is bad? i find your comment extremely rude and insulting and it hurts me - i'm trying to understand abstracts.

what your saying is - because your a painter that you muse be better than i am - is that what your saying? sorry if you don't like my learning process, sorry if you think it's a mockery, comments like yours are just disappointing. no i won't give up - do you think i would mock if you tried photography? you have questions, i help you out, and this is how you repay it? it's sad....

i'm throwing a tantrum? how so? i'm really curious how or why you think that. and why you think that my stuff is any worse then anything else out there.


---Mike Savad

 

Dan Turner

2 Years Ago

I like this one, I think this will sell. Especially if viewers examine the hi-res previews; lots of great stuff happening there.

Art Prints

 

Patricia Strand

2 Years Ago

Mike, I do like "Lost in the City." Perhaps you could do more like this. Reminds me a little of the mid-century California pottery decorations done by Sascha Brastoff. I don't feel much emotion for the others, and I'm only saying that because that's what you were asking. I'm not a painter, however.

 

Shana Rowe

2 Years Ago

I agree with Dan on this one!! I think it is my favorite out of this batch!!

 

Someone is trying to do art they are not used to or knowledgeable about. They are asking advice and being honest about why they need that advice

1. Do not flame, abuse, or insult another user by harassment or by referring to sexual orientation, gender, race, religion, national origin, or disability. Arguments that go beyond reasonable debate will be removed from the forum.

http://fineartamerica.com/showmessages.php?messageid=260080

 

Lee Dos Santos

2 Years Ago

Number 3 and 5 have a good chance of selling. I'm not an Abstract Aficionado but I think those two are very well done.

 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

i like that splatter one mostly because i like tossing paint, it also looks like a yellow chicken at a certain angle. i have a few other ideas to pay with. using a sponge seems to work pretty well for applying. it's how i did my bedroom.


---Mike Savad

 

Shana Rowe

2 Years Ago

Sponging is fun, and I love splattering, I use it a lot even though I don't do a lot of abstract. I see what you mean about the chicken lol

 

Lara Ellis

2 Years Ago

I like this one:
Photography Prints

And this one:
Sell Art Online

The first makes me think of a picnic and the second water. The feeling in these to me is calming, they make me think of my favorite element water. :-)

 

Blanche Knake

2 Years Ago

Mike,
The one that speaks to me most is Just Another Monday, but I wonder why the splash from right to left for a Monday. I would think the spew would go the other way for a Monday, as coming from a weekend and being the blah day Just Another Monday invokes, it would fall on the other days. Just my take, and my POV. Mind you, my tendencies are symmetrical, so anything other than that are quite deliberate for me. I am sure there is a good reason for your right to left splash, would love to hear it!

Other than that, I am not fond of happy faces, but understand the cultural significance in a Forest Gump kind of way.
The others to me are just fine abstacts, they just don't call out to me.

A departure from your other work I love so much for sure!!

 

David Lane

2 Years Ago

While I don't know a lot about abstracts , the one Abstract Acrylic Just another Monday is fun to look at and that validates it in my mind. All of the art I have sold on FAA is abstract, it seems to be a tough sell.

 

Rich Franco

2 Years Ago

Mike,

I would post all of these, I think you may be feeling a bit of a push back from artists that specialize in this and are a bit confused, how a "photographer" SHOULD EVEN ATTEMPT,SORRY, lUCI JUST WALKED ACROSS THE KEYBOARD, as I was saying, should even attemp to "imitate" real painters. The bottom line is, "will they sell" and you won't know until you post these. I wouldn't ask others for opinions as i wouldn't expect you to ask for opinions on your photography images, "just do it".

Let the sales determine if these are "ART" or not, not the remarks by the others that also "own" the space!

You can be quite the ass sometimes and are frequently a nuisance and self-absorbed fellow, but I think you have a talent and should be applauded for that.

No one here, not you or me, knows what will sell and shouldn't discourage those attemps.

Rich

 

David Lane

2 Years Ago

I just spent some more time looking and rising power is dramatic but a little muddy for my taste but a good effort at expressionism imho

 

Leslie Bilbrey

2 Years Ago

I'm not much for abstracts, so I think I like Lost in the city the best because it has the least amount. It is just a personal preference. I do like it because it is simple, colorful, but you can tell what it is.

 

Minnie Lippiatt

2 Years Ago

Sell Art Online I don't know why but I like this one. Somethings just appeal to me although I don't get why. :o) Painting abstract can be challenging for most of us. So glad your exploring and getting out of your comfort level. It shows courage.

 

Donna Renier

2 Years Ago

In order posted:

Confusion
Joy
Excitement
Serenity
Comfort
Fear

i get a whole spectrum....



 

David Lane

2 Years Ago

Leslie this is not a put down please don't take this as an attack, Your response illustrates a prime reason people are not much for abstracts. You are trying to figure out what it is . You seem to have the notion as a lot of people do. that abstracts must be something from the real world , that it must be representing something . The first question for approaching abstracts should be how does it make me feel or what do I see. later you may ask was the artist doing an abstract interpretation, is it Representative abstract?

 

Jeffrey Campbell

2 Years Ago

I think two of them qualify as partial abstracts, and the remainder would be considered total abstracts.

Big Skip

This is a very popular discussion with 154 responses.   In order to help the page load faster and allow you to quickly read the most recent posts, we're only showing you the oldest 25 posts and the newest 25 posts.   Everything in the middle has been skipped.   Want to read the entire discussion?   No problem: click here.

 

Kim Bird

2 Years Ago

I like the red house with purple sky.
Photography Prints

 

Xoanxo Cespon

2 Years Ago

Just to clarify something!!! For me years of experience may be of no importance but I would have to make a difference from "experience" (as an adverb) and "to experience" (as a verve). As a verve is of prime importance for "to experience" is "to be alive, aware and conscious of one's surrounding and inner-self".

To gather experience (adverb) can be a double edged sword, some with experience become wiser, some more bitter. In Art I would not like to empathise the importance of accumulative experience gained over time but at the same time "to understand Art, I couldn't overemphasise the importance of experiencing the process by oneself".

I thought I should clarify this, as in defence of my 10 years statement it may have seemed that I considered important to gain experience through years of experience which I don't. I have met people much younger than me that I consider, braver, much more loving, honest, sincere, generous, creative, genuine and artistic than myself. My children are a good example of what I am trying to say here.

So, no I do not consider years of experience to be necessarily of massive importance to create more sincere and truthful art (If it was so, all the latest pieces of all Artist would have been considered the best pieces, and that is not the case. Picasos's "Guernica" nor "Demoiselles..." considered to be his most significant works were not his last, and list could go on and on....

 

Robert James Hacunda

2 Years Ago

your 20 minutes are up...........RJ

 

Patricia Strand

2 Years Ago

Mike, this is getting frustrating to read. I think you are confusing learning and knowledge with experience, and they are not the same. Experience is what happens between the lessons. You can't rush that. You can come to the same conclusion without experience, but you'll miss all the little nuances that show up in those works and provide depth. I wish I could explain this better, but some things cannot be explained in the way you want to hear, at least by me. I'm sure someone can do a better job at it.

 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

people learn differently than others, i'm not mixing things up or confusing things. i learn differently than most.

---Mike Savad

 

It's how society perceives the manipulation of color/form/illusions/etc that you do as an artist that the buying audience are feeding on, and probably much more so as an abstract artist. You can't erase a person's live's memories and their environments and how they interact inside their brain, though you can hit someone upside the head with a good 36" Louisville Slugger, or they may suddenly develop Alsheimer or amnesia, but that's the minority. All your social upbringing, your environment, your ecosystem, your "hood", your culture, the obvious and subliminal signals around you, and much more, affects your reaction to art, whether psychologically, physically, or physiologically. That said, here's one among many writings of how color affects the human psyche, which is only one among many affects your art plays on the human psychology/physics/physiology. And this doesn't even attempt to touch on the metaphysics, the hollistic, the out-of-bodies or any of the more subjective feelings people may experience at the same time.

All artists to some degree take the above into consideration when they produce art and most even do it subconsciously, that's when art starts to flow in their blood.

-W



 

Robert Kernodle

2 Years Ago

I could not help but make these observations about Rose Art's response:

ROSE: "There can be no disconnect between head heart and hand."

ROBERT: Sure there can be. If, by "heart", one means love, joy, admiration, etc, then these very things can, in fact, get in the way of unhampered sensation and perception. As I have suggested before, there is a primal ground from which all these higher, heartfelt things emerge, and this ground consists of pure color, contrast, texture, shape, contour, pattern, and visual harmony. The eyes express these qualities to the mind, ... first, ... before any other psychological action takes place. And it is quite possible to paint or create from this primal ground primarily, ... with little thought (head), heart (emotion), or even consciously intending hand.


ROSE: "It [art, I assume] has to come from somewhere, the seed must be authentic."

ROBERT: "Authentic" to me means "primal", and I have just described the basis of primal perception and response.


ROSE: "The translation to the visual works or does not."

ROBERT: There need be no TRANSLATION at all. There need be NO moving from such an internal state to an external solidification of it. All abstract art simply is NOT about TRANSLATING, any more than all forms of writing are about translating. We can write to describe, to sing a song, to make poetry, to convey information about a news story, etc. The idea that abstract art is ONLY about TRANSLATING the heart's feelings is too limiting.


ROSE: " Its success is never a complete accident."

ROBERT: In the way that people ordinarily think of the word, "accident", its success (I beg to differ) SOMETIMES can be a complete accident. Now my greater feeling on this is that the word, "accident" itself might be a defunct concept, when we observe events of reality from the broadest possible perspective.


ROSE: "Abstraction is a language like any other."

ROBERT: Abstraction CAN be a language, but, again, it does NOT have to be. It is so much more. It is BEYOND language on many occasions.


ROSE: "It is as if you, Mike, woke up one day and decided you would speak Hungarian, without ever learning or hearing it first. That would be babble.

ROBERT: Again, the language analogy seems to force fit an approach that is woven so much more deeply into the human perceptual organism. It is more as if Mike woke up one day and tried to play tennis, without ever having stepped onto a tennis court first. He has played ping pong, handball, and squash, but never tennis specifically, thus, not yet familiarizing certain neural pathways into the specific perceptual habits needed to play tennis. He just needs more practice at tennis.


ROSE: "Head heart eye and hand. It HAS to be a response to something, from the artist."

ROBERT: Response to color. Response to contrast. Response to texture. Response to pattern. Response to visual harmony. The only real response is "Do I like it?" Trial, error, repetition, discovery, evaluation, more repetition, more trial, more error, etc. This is how a child learns to walk. There is no EXPRESSION of a need to walk. There is no TRANSLATION of a heartfelt desire to walk. There is a TENDENCY to walk already biologically ingrained, ... a REFLEX, ... and when awakened, it evolves by perception, repetition, and refinement under a continuously judging eye.


ROSE: "If its nothing from nothing it is nothing."

ROBERT: Assuming that nothing is happening when less than brilliant results occur is nothing but a less than accurate observation.

 

Robert James Hacunda

2 Years Ago

Learning Style
Mike you fit right smack in between the 5w6 learning style slot ...RJ

 

Daniel Rauch

2 Years Ago

"There can be no understanding between the hand and the brain unless the heart acts as mediator." - Fritz Lang

 

Lawrence Supino

2 Years Ago

@Mike...

“people learn differently than others, i'm not mixing things up or confusing things. i learn differently than most.”

“so far the best review i have is, the name is lost in the skip,but she said the streaky one looked angry. this tells me it has too much red in it, less is better in this case. small things like that are often enough to show me something”

You are actually saying that because one person thinks your image looks angry, that it tells you there’s too much red…and less red is better????

Yeah…if you want to sell the piece to her… or only those like her!! lol

What ever way it is you think you learn above all others… it’s true…you do! Lol…Keep up the good deductions!!

Is this piece angry?

Sell Art Online

 

Zeana Romanovna

2 Years Ago

Red is not only anger - red is also passion.

 

Red: represents danger, warning, or error, but also warmth, love, passion, and intense emotion. Can also symbolize bravery, war, or blood. Some studies have shown it to stimulate appetite (which is why there's so much red at McDonald's restaurants) and improve accuracy on certain tasks.

[editorial] The last one's for all you vampires out there!


-W

 

Daniel Rauch

2 Years Ago

red also can be used to express power

 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

great, now i want to eat nutella.

the thing is i've read about color theory, but i'm wondering if it's a quantity thing. like a lot of red means anger, a little means love? or would it depend on what color it's coupled with?

red is the color of ketchup i know that much for sure.



each conclusion a person makes is another bit of information that could be used. yes it is a jump but it's how i do things. learn something from somewhere, and apply it to the new thing, even if they aren't related. like putting bondo on a car, can be used for cake frosting too (just use a different squeegee.)

@robert - according to my eneagram i took in 2004 i showed as a 4. then in 2011 i was a type 5 it shows sp, so,sx if that means anything. otherwise i'm an INTJ for the MBTI.


---Mike Savad

 

Xoanxo Cespon

2 Years Ago

Robert, yes I agree with most you have said, as a response to Rose (I have reservations on the tennis thing), I hoped my wikepedia bit would in a way point to much of what you have said.

The tennis bit, I guess by watching tennis you could actually get to explain the game quite accurately, it would prove more difficult to explain how it feels to play tennis, to train for a game of tennis (at different levels), to explain the experience of joy when winning a game or tournament, after years of hard training for hours through seasons and weather conditions, to explain, the dreams associated with the practice of the game and how that felt, the sensation of achievement, failure,or simply of that perfect contact with the ball when an ace is delivered.

Why do we not see in games with 100% aces? If you achieve one, surely you would have learned from it an be able to repeat it!!! Ah if it was that simple though!!!!

 

David Lane

2 Years Ago

well said Xoanxo

 

Vivian ANDERSON

2 Years Ago

!

 

P S

P S

2 Years Ago

I like this quote :


"Abstract painting is abstract. It confronts you. There was a reviewer a while back who wrote that my pictures didn't have any beginning or any end. He didn't mean it as a compliment, but it was." - Jackson Pollock


Jackson Pollock didn't just decided one day to throw paint at a canvas, it happened organically and intuitively and as much by chance as by reason. Context matters. Process matters. The psychic energy that the artist puts into it matters.

 

Mike Savad

2 Years Ago

well do keep in mind that when someone interviews you as an artist, you have to play the part. after a while you start believing in the character you made. we may never know what started his look. was he painting a table? did he knock a can off the shelf? who knows. once you find something that works for you, you go with it. what he was really thinking was unknown.

---Mike Savad

 

Zeana Romanovna

2 Years Ago

Mike I see you as INTJ totally. Coming from INTP.

 

P S

P S

2 Years Ago

What matters is that he did it and others didn't. Why he did it was because he was he and not anyone else and not you and me. His paintings is what he was thinking, and not what he thought someone else would like to think or be reminded about or what would sell.

 

Xoanxo Cespon

2 Years Ago

Mark Rothko, once returned his handsome fee for a commission and kept the paintings to himself. It is an interesting story here's an extract from wikepedia:

"The artist Mark Rothko was engaged to paint a series of works for the restaurant in 1958. Accepting the commission, he secretly resolved to create "something that will ruin the appetite of every son-of-a-bitch who ever eats in that room." Observing the restaurant's pretentious atmosphere upon his return from a trip to Europe, Rothko abandoned the project altogether, returned his advance and kept the paintings for himself."

These paintings ended up in London, I was fortunate to see them for myself. Here is an interesting article on the subject:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2002/dec/07/artsfeatures

Ironically, we now find cheap Rothko's prints in every cheap furniture or decorative stores.

 

Lawrence Supino

2 Years Ago

@Philip… “Jackson Pollock didn't just decided one day to throw paint at a canvas, it happened organically and intuitively and as much by chance as by reason.”


Look into the artist, Janet Sobel (what years she did her drip paintings and when she dropped out of sight) and when Pollock saw her work. Also look into David Siqueiros, Andre Masson, and Hans Hofmann (one of my favorites ;)

Pollock’s intuition had inspiration, some say. ;))

 

Rose Art

2 Years Ago

This is the best thread I have seen here for a long time. Robert K. I so enjoyed your post, and everyone's.

@ Robert K. 12:52

"ROSE: "There can be no disconnect between head heart and hand."

ROBERT: Sure there can be. If, by "heart", one means love, joy, admiration, etc, then these very things can, in fact, get in the way of unhampered sensation and perception. As I have suggested before, there is a primal ground from which all these higher, heartfelt things emerge, and this ground consists of pure color, contrast, texture, shape, contour, pattern, and visual harmony. The eyes express these qualities to the mind, ... first, ... before any other psychological action takes place. And it is quite possible to paint or create from this primal ground primarily, ... with little thought (head), heart (emotion), or even consciously intending hand. "

Yes absolutely. The primal ground you speak of is first and foremost for me. I walk into a gallery or Museum, stand at the entry and scan. What visually smacks me in the face, before any other level of understanding happens, is what I walk up to. I love what you said.

Also I did not mean that nothing was happening when the less than brilliant, or less than perfect translation was the result of the artistic effort. Only, that that is part of the process. Sometimes you win sometimes you lose. It doesn't always "work". It is hard, not easily come by,and is never happenstance. If it is from something it can't be nothing.

I still stand by head, heart, eye and hand.

 

Robert Kernodle

2 Years Ago

The point of the tennis analogy is that athletic prowess develops through trial, error, and repetition, and this development is specific for each sport, no matter how similar the sports might seem. "Specificity of conditioning" is what the human performance experts call it. ... very little to do with the heart or head. ... everything to do with moving through experiences and building upon them reflexively.

 

Dan Turner

2 Years Ago

"Pollock’s intuition had inspiration, some say. ;))"

You bet, Lawrence. Art doesn't spring unaided or uninfluenced from the human psyche. Art actually has a long, rich history, filled with "OMG that's where that came from" moments.

 

Rose Art

2 Years Ago

Maybe painters have a different departure, a different process, resulting in a different outcome. Maybe that is one of the things that helps to define, and differentiate . But probably not, as I know many multi media artists who understand the importance of the "departure".

Art does indeed have a long rich history of influences.

ps. That would be head heart and HAND . Without the "hand", it isn't what I meant.

IF it can't be effectively translated, its a wash. So we agree on prowess being an essential part of the formula.

 

This discussion is closed.