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Jeff Folger

9 Days Ago

Your View On Market Research

I'm not a guru when it comes to market research. The pros out there say you need to know your customer and put your work in front of them.

My thought on this, is to ask your thoughts here.
One of the long tail keywords I try to be found for is "New England fall foliage".
On big and Yahoo my jeff-foliage.com comes up on the first page for these two search engines.

Google on the other hand brings my Facebook fall foliage page up on page 2, along with a CBS link and my website on page 3.

Ok here is my market research question. Knowing yourself what would a query on Google look like if you are thinking New England and fall foliage?
Are looking for locations, forecasts or ???
If you have no interest in this subject post your keyword that you are trying to be found for... also are you trying to send them to your AW or a separate website?

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Mike Savad

9 Days Ago

people look for the fall at the end of summer. they want to know what's in color or where to go. other photographers want to know this. how many want to get art and look for that? hard to know. i don't bother looking for myself in google, i have so many subjects, i think they find me in images mostly. pinterest comes up a little too much, i think they are eating away at all my links, wish they would vanish.

i would assume people would append ART to their search, hard to know if they would look for fall in particular. but we can't see the keywords used, not even in analytics. for now all i want is my name found, since that's consistent. and people recognize the style pretty fast if they were exposed to it.

usually in google i will type in my name, and then see what it suggests, to get an idea of how people find me or what they are looking for.


----Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

 

Mike Savad

9 Days Ago

so typing that in, i saw -

mike savad wikipedia, prints, twitter and then some pods. the word "information" used to be on there. i'm not sure why facebook would matter, unless i banned someone. just by adding a space - ART came up.

when i typed your name foliage was the first thing, then 8x8? leaves and fall photos are also in there.


----Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

 

Jeff Folger

9 Days Ago

Thanks Mike, I assume you typed in Jeff folger into google.
When you are thinking about key wording your images though are you scattered across many different genre's or do you shoot more focused.
As most people know I have a lot of passion fall foliage so most of my keywords are heavily weighted on this subject.
So what I'm curious about are peoples thoughts on what it takes to get noticed in search (not on this site).
@Mike, do you group most of your key wording in hand colored images. I know you have more types of images so what is your and others thoughts when you key word

 

Mike Savad

9 Days Ago

i'm not sure what you mean by group. i just list locations and objects, year etc.

with fall trees, i would want to be exact - like town, county, road?, bridges etc. people have their favorite location. and new england covers a very large area, one would type vermont fall trees or a county in there.

for colorized i'm as exact as i can be. for ones i shoot, i am less so, sometimes. i don't people knowing its their house.

----Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

 

Vince Migliore

9 Days Ago

Sounds like your search-engine efforts are working pretty well.
I know Google Ad words has a tool where you can put in keywords and they will suggest other search terms.
I would add individual states, such as New Hampshire, Vermont, Maine, as these are popular tourist destinations
for Fall foliage.I would also use "leaves," "trees," "fall colors," etc.

 

Jeff Folger

9 Days Ago

I usually put the town like Pomfret Vermont but I havent put the road like Galaxy hill rd. And Vermont fall foliage and New England fall foliage..

Ok, do you want a shocker... wordpress hide the keywords that I put in there... all this time I thought those keywords were helping. From what I'm hearing only the descriptions and alt text get revealed...

 

Mike Savad

9 Days Ago

google wants to see keywords related to the things your talking about. so if you shot something on galaxy hill rd, and mention it in a description, it prefers that over the stray keyword added. you'll get more pull with very descriptive texts.


----Mike Savad
http://www.MikeSavad.com

 

Jeff Folger

9 Days Ago

Well Mike, I think I do pretty good most of the time although I dont always get all the keywords in the description.. I have long detailed descriptions for the most part...

 

Chuck Staley

8 Days Ago

In this or a similar thread it was mentioned that we liked when bots were added to our viewer numbers.

A couple of days ago I added the word "mannequin" to the tags and a one-line description to this image that was uploaded 6 years ago in 2013.

This image became my No. 1 image for the week on FAA with 94 views that one day.

So I guess you don't have to do that much to increase your bot views.

Sell Art Online

 

Jeff Folger

8 Days Ago

Well Chuck I think I and several others agree and having the bots suddenly appear with many views refreshes the image in your catalog of images. But if I may ask, do you market to the masses in any other ways?
Being fresh in search is good but do you tie that in with anything else. It could be a blog or even a story about the image on Facebook?

 

Chuck Staley

8 Days Ago

I am beginning to market more on Facebook, Jeff, though my "friends" have yet to purchase over the past 10 years.

But I post every 30 minutes on Twitter every day and can look at Twitter Analytics to see which tweets get the most response.

I am selective about who I follow and have a couple of accounts with different followers.

Since I signed with an art licensing agency a little over a year ago with my brand name, my work is now on a dozen or more websites who advertise profusely,
so everywhere I go I see slideshows of my art flashing by. It's pretty annoying, but then it's MY art, so I guess I shouldn't complain.

 

Adam Jewell

8 Days Ago

Something that includes prints, Wall Art, posters, metal prints, canvas or some other product keyword appended to whatever the subject is probably indicates a shopper on a search engine outside of FAA. Anything without a product modifier might be a shopper but probably isn’t. Still good exposure though.

 

TL Mair

7 Days Ago

I have posted a few new photographs and the bots are going crazy, more than i have noticed for a while, just today i have one from Paris France, haven't seen that before.

When I do a Google search for TL Mair, both my site here and mairsphotography.com come up on the first page, that would be the only key word that all of my things would have in common, but that would be pretty specific for a search however it does happen, a couple of months ago i got a phone call from a regional medical center they had tried to buy a large framed print from here but the order was over a thousand dollars and FAA wouldn't run their card twice for the transaction, they had a $999.00 limit per transaction on the company card, anyway one of the office people (at the hospital) suggested they Google me so i was still able to make the sale, but that is the one time that has happened.

Other than a specific search i am not all that sure Google is really much good now a days, it used to be that searching on Google you could find exactly what you wanted now it seams like you have to wade through a million paid ads, then try to filter out everything that Google assumed you meant rather than just stick to the search words!I

TL
http://mairsphotography.com

 

Jeff Folger

7 Days Ago

Even though I put my name in the keywords, I assume few people are looking for me by name.
If they have to locate me by my name then I feel I'm doing my job wrong.

I try to make it very easy for them to find links to my AW. I'm going back and editing old articles on my blog and any image that has an image that is also up on my AW, I put a link in the caption that links to my AW.

Basically I bring people to my Jeff Foliage to help with their fall foliage plans but once there they have many options to go to my Art.

My keywords and descriptions are all, directing traffic to my artist website. Hopefully since our AWs get very little search (almost none) search visibility due to coding, I have to bring them to my blog website and then to my AW.

I do image searches for my images in Google and my FAA and Pixels based images come up but I've only found one or two keywords where my AW based website comes up. I'm not sure why those particular images come up, but it does happen once in a while.

I drove 14 people yesterday to my AW and so the struggle continues

 

TL Mair

6 Days Ago

"Even though I put my name in the keywords, I assume few people are looking for me by name.
If they have to locate me by my name then I feel I'm doing my job wrong."

That was my point on having to be a pretty specific search, and I agree if they know your name, they probably already know your images/website.

As for the AW I have been wondering lately if promoting the AW is kind of a waist of time considering it is impossible to build SEO for that site, but I still believe sending people to a trapped web site is better than showing them other peoples work.

My Mair's Photography website was originally used for my portrait/wedding business which is gone now so trying to purge that from search engines is troublesome, however I do try and do what Jeff does on my Mair's Photography website I link every image to that image on my AW, I link titles to the correct image on my AW, and I link to a specific gallery, or collection on my AW for each thing that I blog about, however my blogging skills are not very good, but I know google likes content so I plug along.

That "new" web site is just a baby now so it is going to take time to get people to it.

I do like the way Jeff does the blog for fall colors in New England something that I am sure a lot of people are looking for, that kind of a blog has got to go a long ways to helping promote a persons art.

TL
http://mairsphotography.com

 

Jeff Folger

6 Days Ago

Thanks TL, please list your blog and we will stop in to check it out. Blogging takes time and keeping it fresh is critical and actually not too hard...
More later after I get off from work...

 

Jeff Folger

5 Days Ago

TL, I looked a little at your site and since I'm on my phone I couldn't delve into the code. But the first thing you should think about a responsive theme. Meaning if someone shows up on a phone like I just did it needs to format the page delivered to fit a phone. Yours gave me a desktop version. Google will sing you for that.
When I get time I'll go back and look at it from my desktop.

 

TL Mair

5 Days Ago

Thanks Jeff, the problem i have with the phone deal, I use web easy pro to build my site and i have not found a way to build a phone friendly site, the site is hosted by godaddy, and i don't know if they use a separate folder for it or not, i think some do it that way,but not sure.

Edited to add apparently i need to build two sites and then create a link on my main page so they can link to the mobile site, I will need too contact godaddy to find out what i need to do on their end.
Thanks again

TL
http://mairsphotography.com

 

@ Jeff, I see your intent about 5 posts ^ up that way.

Since the AW (artist websites) you are implying are basically dead ducks floating on water (not searchable) due to a lack of SEO meta tags/snippets etc.., you are instead using your autumn tour guide blog to corral some traffic and redirect them (hopefully qualified buyers) to your AW for a shopping experience. In essence, your blog is being used as a click-through link.

From a marketing perspective, I can't imagine leaf peepers planning a destination & trip would be inclined to do a 180 and follow a link to invest their autumn travel expense budget on prints or other items. You'll be increasing your site visitation to some degree, certainly. It's is a mixed message of sorts, first offering insightful travel information on a separate blog website, and then requesting them to come to view your collection of available prints from the region.

Have you considered a website where you can sell prints by way of an e-commerce platform and plug-in your blog? This way you'll be benefitting from all your SEO and SMM and your blog visitors won't need to leave your website to view the galleries.



 

TL Mair

5 Days Ago

T-S That would/could get real pricey real fast, not to mention more time consuming that I thought it was worth.

I went that route "once" that was all it took to forget about my own e-commerce shopping cart...just sayin.

TL

 

Mario Carta

5 Days Ago

I hear New England Foliage and I'm thinking it might be time to visit Middletown CT my once home town to view in person the changing of the leaves,in fact I have an open invitation from a cousin to do just that.

As an artist I don't care if I'm found or not, enough people that pass in front of my house Know my art, for every other business need I still advertise in my local newspaper in the classified section and for my main business I come up on Google when people look for my services very high up locally. I only put money into print classifieds ads in my local newspaper, that keeps the phone ringing every day.

Hopes this helps your market research. :-)

 

@ TL Mair. I've done it, several times, and what your saying could be misleading, sorry. It's subjective by saying "what YOU thought it was worth" and it doesn't necessarily state facts. If it wore you thin and you realized the efforts didn't pay off or lacked the tech-savvy, that's not a crime and I commend the effort for at least taking a whack at it.

Several factors to consider. Your "ROI" in terms of both time and capital investment is significant. Why invest so much time into SMM and work so hard or pay for SEO to point it towards someone's POD? The price is a one time fee, the only fee would be for site domain and host. Jeff has good background building a Wordpress website thus reducing his investment by a LOT. There are some pretty awesome site designs set up (if one uses WP) for the medium that he could get set up in about a week and populated with images pretty quickly. I don't doubt Jeff's ambition for a second. It would really suck to look back years from now and say "coulda, shoulda" and I'm glad I didn't.

BTW, I'm about to launch my "third website" in just a few weeks for my photography workshops and instructional video's. I recently had 8 participants in one of my Saturday morning Phase I - Beginners to DSLR/Mirrorless workshops for $150.00 ea. My investment was 150 minutes of my time, which just paid for my newest website design and calendar plug-in up front and 3 years for the domain/host. That was just using ONE Saturday morning as an example. I loved every minute of it, the group had a blast and each of them is planning for and scheduling Phase II guided workshops this spring & summer. I'm not mentioning this to be braggart, I'm only trying to deliver a positive message and say "yes You can.."

 

TL Mair

5 Days Ago

T-S I thought we were talking about building a shopping cart, and populating it with all the various images and sizes along with prices. Not workshops which I understand can be profitable.

 

@ TL

Nope, the subject was marketing, market research, directing traffic to AW, lack of search visibility on FAA's AW sites, getting high Google ranking etc..

Here's a few quotes from Jeff:
"So, what I'm curious about are peoples thoughts on what it takes to get noticed in (Google) search."

Here's another quote from Jeff,
"Basically, I bring people to my Jeff Foliage to help with their fall foliage plans, but once there, they have many options to go to my Art."

Lastly, Jeff wrote,
"My keywords and descriptions are all, directing traffic to my artist website. Hopefully, since our AWs get very little search (almost none) search visibility due to coding, I have to bring them to my blog website and then to my AW".

I countered with what I wrote and suggested a website to corral both his SEO, SEM and SMM efforts along with an e-commerce platform (which is a pre-designed site with the ability to nest product, sizes, etc)

I can only imagine you were taken down the wrong path somehow when you "went that route". My point about the workshops was my SEO, SMM and personal websites (with good page 1 SEO) filled my class with students, and future workshops. I took all the steps that you said are "pricey and more time consuming than what they are worth".

 

TL Mair

4 Days Ago

And here is a quote from you:


“Have you considered a website where you can sell prints by way of an e-commerce platform and plug-in your blog? This way you'll be benefitting from all your SEO and SMM and your blog visitors won't need to leave your website to view the galleries”

 

Jeff Folger

4 Days Ago

Well TL and TS... interesting conversation we have going on here. First to TS. I think I see what you are saying and while I could make my site more about sales but I would then be breaking the rule of blogs. Blogs that work, bring in people by being useful.
Once I bring them in with good solid advice based on my 20 yrs of experience they start to notice my photographs, very nice ones... and I think many of them are better than what they can take themselves. I believe I build customer loyalty through my blog. They use the information and they return year after year. According to Google my website and Facebook are good referrals to my AW, with a high retention rate.
I also have as TL has noticed that I have themed galleries on my site from the Pixels shopping cart website plugin. I have people exploring these daily.
If someone asks about the best time for New England fall foliage in 2019 I come up on the 1st page of most search engines.
Rarely does somebody search for Jeff Foliage they (according to Google) ask questions to solve their problem like when is the best time to visit new England to catch peak fall colors in 2019.... or some variable like this. You can check me but that or similar queries will bring up my website.
This brings in around 200,000 views a year.
A bit off topic but if I try to pull them in and just sell them art, I think I would fail. This method has been growing my base each year.

This discussion is very interesting and it obvious that you are a good teacher and you are able to market those skills with your websites.

The question I and TL may have are what are the templates you are using that are so easy to set up?

A real html website is good to have because it should be faster than a wordpress site.

Market research to me is the means and methods by which we get people in the door. Some people have websites, or use FB groups to post to and you use your training classes to build your brand.

I think all these things are good ways to leverage our expertise to connect with customers...
I'm just curious if there are others as well???

Jeff-foliage.com

 

TL Mair

4 Days Ago

Personally as i said before i think Jeff has a unique niche with the fall colors of New England something that most people understand are beautiful and want to see, and i think capitalizing on that is a great idea, here in Utah we have mountains and canyons and they never move but those pesky fall colors are fickle at best and finding someone to predict them could be useful, a few years ago my son and i went too NY in October partly to see the fall colors we were early that year and got there at the end of one hurricane and the beginning of another wish that would have been planned better, tho the largest photo i have ever sold was taken on that trip of a Yankees game! But i digress.

I think anything that will bring viewers to our stores is a good thing, I wonder what the stats are for how many people you have to have come to the site just to make one sale.

As for teaching seminars that's great but for my self my brain doesn't work that way, I can take photos and from experience know exactly what i need to do to get the shot the way i want it, but to convey that to another person or class that is very difficult for me, I can answer questions all day long but my brain won't format that information into a lesson.

I am open to all suggestions, and critique that could/would help me get more eyes on my photography!

TL

 

Jeff Folger

4 Days Ago

Well TL, we each have to capitalize on our strengths. You could pick each of your images and tell a story about it via your blog.
Where and when and maybe even why it came to be.
The where could be where to find it and is it a hike, staying over night and catching it first thing with the Dawn's light. Or can you drive by at anytime and find a decent shot?

This is all I do, tell people stories about my neck of the woods. You could easily do the same and with the quality of your work, you should be seeing really good traffic or at least an increase.

 

@ Jeff.

Q: "The question I have are what are the templates you are using that are so easy to set up?"

This is really simple stuff. Currently, my SM marketing solution is building a WP site based on a template design that's easy to find. The template is also capable of nesting (2) sites. A booking calendar is synched with a plug-in. For now, the primary focus is just the photo workshops, making the purchase of Gift cards available, and localized SEO. Once the dust settles we're adding the second nested page to upload and market photo prints. Plenty of plug-ins are available that you don't need to build from scratch, exapmles such as Envira gallery and WooCommerce. You can find more info to make the best personal decision by Googling "19 best Wordpress Plugins for Photographers". It's all wide open for the public to find. I've seen the demonstrations with my own eyes.

By the way, I'm not looking for a personal assault from any onlookers or trolls if you have issues with any of the WP themes. I'm not marketing their themes or suggesting.

My current homepage site is based on another platform and I don't think it's fair to bring them to light here on this forum. I'm not out to condemn this option. FAA is still useful for me as a steady income for a different demographic of buyers (decor) than what we are marketing to from my other site. It's just not my primary option.

 

@ Jeff.

Q: "The question I have are what are the templates you are using that are so easy to set up?"

This is really simple stuff. Currently, my SM marketing solution is building a WP site based on a template design that's easy to find. The template is also capable of nesting (2) sites. A booking calendar is synched with a plug-in. For now, the primary focus is just the photo workshops, making the purchase of Gift cards available, and localized SEO. Once the dust settles we're adding the second nested page to upload and market photo prints. Plenty of plug-ins are available that you don't need to build from scratch, exapmles such as Envira gallery and WooCommerce. You can find more info to make the best personal decision by Googling "19 best Wordpress Plugins for Photographers". It's all wide open for the public to find. I've seen the demonstrations with my own eyes.

By the way, I'm not looking for a personal assault from any onlookers or trolls if you have issues with any of the WP themes. I'm not marketing their themes or suggesting.

My current homepage site is based on another platform and I don't think it's fair to bring them to light here on this forum. I'm not out to condemn this option. FAA is still useful for me as a steady income for a different demographic of buyers (decor) than what we are marketing to from my other site. It's just not my primary option.

 

Jeff Folger

4 Days Ago

Well, if anyone flames you about wp themes here I would let Abbie know she is death on trolls or those who are not polite.
The reason I ask about templates/themes is because each of them brings a different level of functionality with them. I would love to find a theme that does most of what I want it to do without needing any plugins. Keeping the number of plugins to a minimum is the holy grail of blogging. Less plugins = faster site.

 

Bradford Martin

4 Days Ago

As to your first question, the first phrase the comes to mind is "Fall color", prefaced by New England or state names.

I am a big believer in long tail searches as a market niche. My most popular is "offshore oil rigs."
As I don't have an active blog, I have usually have to append a word(s) like art or art prints to see any significant results. But even without those words I have had good success in being on the front page with that phrase. I also do well with Port Canaveral cruise ship, but much better with "art print" added.

I often link to my FAA page because it is far easier to get a top ranking on the front page with that. It just depends on if i am linking for the Google bots or my own audience. Much better to be in Google on page one with a link to FAA than page 100 with a link to my AW.

That said, lately I noticed i am getting ranked high with my AW on some searches, so I am linking to that more. I got out of the habit of checking my Google analytics for my AW because it showed nothing for years. I made some recent changes init so as to get the lock on it and now Google analytics works so I guess I should check it more. That aspect is a mystery to me.
bradmartinphotos.com

 

TL Mair

4 Days Ago

@Jeff Thanks for the advise, I have been trying to do that, but I am afraid I get lazy and don't keep up on the blog, I have a blog site: https://tlmair.blogspot.com/
I did pretty good on keeping it up to date but then let it slide, don't know why really, partly I think because I get an email about blogger stats that says no one goes to the page, but then when I look at the analytics for that page it does show that a few people do go to it, just found that out!! So now I am trying to keep it up to date.

I'm still up in the air about my mairsphotography.com web site, I have looked in the Word Press, and others but what I am seeing is way pricey is there a less expensive alternative for a dynamic web site builder?

As for the AW mentioned by Bradford, on another thread someone said that they haven't gotten any sales from their AW since the switch to V-2 and he sells pretty consistantly each month so I am wondering if trying to link to the AW is becoming a waist of time, and it would be better to just send people to the main FAA page and let the work stand, I do believe my photographs are salable if I can just get the right people to see them.

I post to FB on a business page, however I don't have a lot of followers, and not really sure how to improve that, and the ones I do have don't seam all that interested in sharing not really sure how to best promote.

Anyway thanks for all the good advise!

TL
http://mairsphotography.com

 

Edward Fielding

4 Days Ago

"Market research to me is the means and methods by which we get people in the door."

Market research is understanding your market and your customer.

Marketing is the mix of product, price, promotion and place.

Advertising is communicating a sales message.

 

TL Mair

4 Days Ago

Edward you've given us the headings now show us/me the lessons!...please!

TL
http://mairsphotography.com

 

TL Mair

4 Days Ago

Ok so I just did a search of one of my photographs by title without my name, two of my photographs came second and third on the first page of google (a state park with a similar name came up first) both of those images showed up on FAA no AW to be found, don’t know if that surpasses me or not, then in forth place was my own website, someone remind me again why we work so hard to promote our AWs especially since if I had hair on the back of my neck it would be telling me the powers that be are actually breaking the AWs.
TL

 

Bradford Martin

3 Days Ago

TL Mair we promote our AWs so people will follow the link to our pages and not get lost in the FAA site. Until recently I never gave a thought to getting a high rank on my AW on a keyword other than my name. I play to the bots with FAA links because Google trusts and favors FAA. It just depends on where I am placing the link. And my mood I guess.

 

TL Mair

3 Days Ago

Bradford i know why we do it, but does it really do any good, considering it is part of the FAA umbrella i don't think we can improve the ranking of the AW because i think Google just sees it as part of FAA, and from what i have been reading if you send someone to a particular image in V-2 they are trapped there because there is no way to navigate too the index page, I am on V-1 so i can't really check that out but if it is true that just cripples the AW sites just not sure i like all the V-2 stuff.

TL

 

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