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David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

Art As An Allegory



This very experimental concept discusses man's blindness to climate change as an allegory.

The artistic approach is fascinating to me.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

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Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

David,I'm blind to this experiment.

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

LOL Mario that is the point.....

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Mario Carta

7 Days Ago

Lol!

 

Robert Kernodle

7 Days Ago

Sorry, nothing about it fascinates me. In fact, given the subject, I could see the video representing the level of blindness in those who adhere to an arguably corrupt, absurd narrative. But that's as far as I can go with this line of thinking here.

 

Abbie Shores

7 Days Ago

Robert, three threads I've just seen you in and a curmudgeon in all.

 

Joy McKenzie

7 Days Ago

I thought it said Art as an ALLERGY! :).... I was trying to figure out what that could mean.

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

Here some allegorical Art. Put CO2 is a red balloon and an equal amount of air in a blue balloon, set them in the hot Florida sun. Insert a thermometer into each balloon, see which balloon contains the hottest gas. Try it with methane and compare it with air. Both the blue and the red contains plenty of hot gases do to the intense heat of the Florida sun, one thermometer will have a higher temperature reading.
FUN with science, art and allegory!

"curmudgeon", what an interesting term! So much implication folded with a single word! I learn something every day!

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

Joy,

That is very funny.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Robert Kernodle

7 Days Ago

Sorry, Abbie, but the topics I entered speak to reality, and reality is, unfortunately, laced with curmudgeonocities that are productive to speak on sometimes. One of those topics is one for which I have spent nine years researching the facts.

Avoiding all semblance of such reality isn't healthy in my world. I try to respect your editorial preference for avoiding such tendencies, but sometimes I just have to be me, in all honesty. Otherwise, my appearance here would be just a candy-coated film of who I really am.

I do contribute non-curmudgeon comments -- so, don't judge me totally by those few that fail your editorial filter.

Even without mentioning the associated topic, I honestly see nothing of artistic value in the video that Davide B shared. That's no insult to David. If I were to give a politically neutral review of it, then I would say that it is a waste of pixels in the name of art, because it lacks form, it lacks substance, it lacks narrative, ... it lacks anything that would signal an aesthetic response in a first-time viewer who knew nothing of the artist's vision or artist's contextual framing.

Drew,

I feel a censure coming your way.

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

"Drew,

I feel a censure coming your way."

I think not Robert!
My comment is completely within the spirit of the discussion and the bylaws of the forum.

Allegory is an excellent way artists express their ideas.

David, interesting topic.

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

The subject matter is blindness of the orange heat of the sun.

The artwork is a completely different approach.

An environment is created where human beings wander without seeing each other passing by .

I think the art communicates extremely well. It opens up a perspective.

The perspective, "we are not seeing what is happening in the heat of battle". Just one cliche for it.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

Cliche is often used by artist to express an allegory. The audience must first have common ground to recognize a cliche; same with an allegory.
Esoteric information also can be passed from person to person or group to group within allegorical art without the entire audience understanding the intent of the communication.

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

Yes the artist in this stretches the audience. Fine art will do that.

The audience wants to be stretched.

The elements are the orange with yellow light above. Air moving through the mist. Blindness, fact and in the title.

Without discussing it, we know it is political. But what is far more interesting is how the artist sees the audience.

In that, this is perhaps the ultimate abstract expressionism.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

There are no ultimate abstract expressions. There is communication percieved correctly then there is misunderstanding of intent. And then there is partial understanding.
To claim something is the ultimate is simply dismissed by finding something better and this is all subjective therefore absolutism doesn't apply. Ultimate implies absolute.

Perfection must exist outside the realm of artistic creation. That's the beauty of art. It's imperfect.

 

Robert Kernodle

7 Days Ago

al·le·go·ry -- a story, poem, or picture that can be interpreted to reveal a hidden meaning, typically a moral or political one.

This can include stories based on fundamental errors or even non-realities. The stories need not be true. The stories can be fantasies.

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

The audience is bathing in the thick colors. The abstract expressionist were committed to studying audience reactions, but with paint on the canvas.

A very complex abstract message comes out of this, well beyond simply a blue room like was in fine art fashion circles a couple of years ago.

The audience reaction evolved as a dialog that is much further flung than "that is crap" as the first AbEx artists sought.

Yes flinging the flung further would be interesting. I have not seen that yet.

I do not see these things as subjective.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

I like the story of the balloons Robert! It's involves direct observation and can be verified over and over again by everyone who chooses to do so. I like balloons, red ones, blue ones and most of all green ones.
David's example is complex but he likes it too. I like the fact that David likes his example. David is not being a curmudgeon.

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

"perhaps the ultimate...."

"not seen it yet".

The objective is not perfect.

That is only the male ego at work hoping so. For others the subjective is perfect. It is not.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Robert Kernodle

7 Days Ago

A balloon filled with CO2 will always warm faster and to a higher temperature, when heated by the hot Florida sun, than does a balloon filled with regular air, because the specific heat of CO2 is lower than that of air. Consequently, less ENERGY is needed to raise one gram of CO2 one degree Celsius than one gram of air one degree Celsius. Drew's balloon "allegory", thus, is an allegory about the principle of physics called "specific heat". Such a wonderful story, ... for those interested in real science, which Drew's red, blue, and green balloons illustrate beautifully.

All this talk of balloons makes me want to see clowns.

David B, I wonder how the majority of people would react to the video that started this topic. Without the context made clear by the title, without knowledge of the related issue, ... with only the visual of the video, I think that most people would find what you call an allegory about blindness ... a visual presentation empty of appeal. What gives the video any basis for aesthetic appeal at all is the context and the specific issue that embeds it in a context. Without the context, there is no story about blindness. Rather, there is emptiness of content.

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

"I think that most people would find what you call an allegory about blindness ... a visual presentation empty of appeal."

No one here speaks for most people.

Title and context are relevant as tools to help with the correct intent at communication.

David, do you think the intent is esoteric or existential? why one over the other if one is predominate? Why do you feel this film is the ultimate expression of abstraction?
Why is this artistic approach fascinating to you?

"I do not see these things as subjective."
Sure you do. You ask for subjectivity all the time.

This film assumes humanity is blinded to an assumed true fact by something ominous. It begs the question which is a fallacy by the nature of the assumptions.

Just because some percieve an existing threat doesn't make the threat a fact; same can be said that there is no threat because it is not imagined by all.

Why is this film not a work of propaganda induced by a specific agenda or a product of modern art philosophy with no significance to anyone not familiar with said philosophy or agenda?

 

David Bridburg

7 Days Ago

Drew,

Can you imagine an approach to AbEx that would go any further?

If not, then FOR NOW this is the ultimate.

I do not see it as subjective. I am not saying, I love this or hate this. I am not expressing much by way of emotion.

The question on fascination, I saw meat in this before fully understanding it.

That answers the last question inherently....at least for me.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Drew

7 Days Ago

"Can you imagine an approach to AbEx that would go any further?"
Yes, I'm currently working on a project that certainly supersedes this experiment and so does my 22 minute high definition film IMHO!
I am sure many other artists can say the same. Once again, a purely subjective matter not an absolute.
I also contended that the video is a form of propaganda following the Modern Art philosophy where as the emphasis is not on art but on controversy. Unless you can articulate why you feel it is the ultimate abstract beyond just saying that it is the ultimate, there exist aleast one who sees it differently therefore negating the "Ultimate" significance as a universal quality.

"Art As An Allegory" is a fantastic subject for discussion David. It's your thread. You can run with it or you can try to convince everyone David B. Now has found the ultimate Abstraction which becomes a reductio ad absurdum argument.

The thread is yours! My takeaway is my newly found term "curmudgeon" thanks to our fantastic forum moderator Abbie!

 

Shawn Dall

7 Days Ago

ehh I don't really like any concept that feels like something simple was done and then a meaning was almost felt like it was added after - like having a room full of empty walls and telling people the art is invisible.

As a detail oriented artist I need more when it comes to appreciating art - but that's me personally - I like things I can observe that I can feel I can interpret on my own not just go "wtf was that" and someone says oh it was to represent such and such" and I just go.. oh.. okay..

Not a big fan of hugely experimental type stuff like that. The whole discussion of "what is art" feels invoked by this sort of stuff. I will always be more of an illustrator :)

Still I suppose it may have been a fun experienced to be bathed in what can only be described as a mustard gas experience.

----Shawn----
shawndall.com

 

VIVA Anderson

7 Days Ago

2 cents.........I'm beginning to recognize here, in forum, a Semantics Clan......thriving on curmudgeons agreeing to disagree.
Very cool, Dave B........the 'read' is fascinating to this lover of semantics.........not so much your premise/vid....
just
the 'talk'........(carry on:nothing to add)..................

 

David Bridburg

6 Days Ago

Vivian,

That is the politics of art speak.

The method is the art.

Usually I would agree with Drew, when going digital you have gone further. But why? Because the layers of abstraction are new and additive.

In this case, the abstraction is the art on the audience. Which for AbEx is an ultimate goal. I need to get that word goal in there.

That does not diminish digital experiences. It is just honest about physical analogue experiences.


Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

VIVA Anderson

6 Days Ago

Thanks, Dave. Point taken.

 

Drew

1 Day Ago

"Usually I would agree with Drew, when going digital you have gone further. But why? Because the layers of abstraction are new and additive."

Dave, you asked me a question and you attempted to answer it; incorrectly by the way! Just another example of someone falsely attributing comments to a person who never made such a statement!

The answer is because I have acquired, developed, and implemented the tools that are available and are NOT new. Digital software and animation are no longer new. It's just more instruments that artists can master if they so choose to.

BTW
I'm surprised you haven't taken this discussion further.

 

A better test would be to use balloons of the same colour and just label what’s in them. A black balloon and a white ballon would give yet again different temperatures as will the red and blue ones due to how each colour absorbs or reflects light/heat.

 

Drew

1 Day Ago

Jest, my hypothetical artistic construction is not intended to actually be a scientific test although anyone with the described material can replicate it.

It is an allegory: hence "Art As An Allegory." The color choices of the balloons have inferred meaning. The content within each described balloon has significance. The comment indicated that both balloons contain hot air but one a little hotter than the other is also an inference. The implied conclusion becomes obvious from a scientific perspective and its social implication is presumption by inference.

The example, because it is an allegory and there are multiple ways to interpret the language, breaks no social contract by the writer towards the audience yet at the same time, the intended message if explicit language is used would violate said contract. (The Mind Police)

Another artistic allegory is the fictional novel " The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe." It is pushed and read throughout public schools in the USA because the intent of the author was hidden within an allegory even though his true intent was openly discussed by the author in several public venues.

 

Aslan, Jadis and Mr. Tumnis walk into a balloon...

 

Drew

1 Day Ago

"Aslan, Jadis and Mr. Tumnis walk into a balloon"
LOL! and boy was it hot!
The new ultimate abstract expressionism......
Perhaps!

 

David Bridburg

15 Hours Ago

The silence in this thread was interrupted.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

Drew

14 Hours Ago

"The silence in this thread was interrupted"

And Dave, now that you have interrupted the silence, grace us with your well of knowledge regarding art as an allegory in which your all knowing artistic wisdom and sage like charisma enlightens all who hear your utterances.

 

Tony Murray

13 Hours Ago

I don't get it.

 

David Bridburg

13 Hours Ago

Tony,

it is not for sale.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

David Bridburg

4 Hours Ago

Drew,

In the scheme of things, longer term history, the digital age is new. This is the early digital age. I wonder what marks the middle digital age?

I was agreeing with your earlier opinions of digital art, in my own way.

Dave Bridburg
https://Bridburg.com

 

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